Flotillusion

Written by

Maya Zankoul

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Many people have been asking me about my opinion regarding the flotilla. Well, here it is. Deforming reality has limits and the world population isn’t 100% stupid to believe all the lies about the ‘weapons’ aboard the flotilla ships. I hope this will not be forgotten in 2 days like what usually happens in the online scene. For 2 days, everyone tweets and blogs heavily about the issue only to completely forget it few days later. In relation to that, here’s Bob Dylan’s amazing ‘Blowin’ in the Wind’.


In other news, if you’re around Tripoli, pass by City Complex this afternoon at 6PM. I’ll be signing my book there at the opening of Amalgame exhibition! See you there 🙂

Have a lovely day!

Comments

82 responses to “Flotillusion”

  1. Wissam M Avatar
    Wissam M

    Nooo don’t go into politics it’s not good :(:(

    Reply
    1. Simon Avatar
      Simon

      Mate first of all Maya’s post is about the MEDIA’s coverage of the incident itself. Second, everyone is allowed to give an opinion about wats happening around us. If anything, Maya’s blog is a representation of every day life, and wat happened is a part of every day life in the middle east. u don’t just ignore it! u discuss it…

      didn’t want to give u a negative score without an opinion with it! sorry mate

      Reply
    2. Ahmad Osman Avatar
      Ahmad Osman

      I absolutely agree with Simon. Neither is politics essentially unethical, nor is it separate from ‘life’, whatever that may be, and our problem here in the Third World lies precisely in the fact that politicians (and our parents) have managed to get us thinking that living clean and good means living apolitical, whereas the illusion of the apolitical is why the civil society is so absent.

      Reply
  2. Tweets that mention Flotillusion | Maya’s Amalgam — Topsy.com

    […] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Jocelyn Tawk, Micheline Hazou, Wissam, Ivy, Bahaa and others. Bahaa said: RT @MayaZankoul: Many people have been asking me about my thoughts on the #flotilla. Well, here it is: http://bit.ly/9EYvzJ […]

    Reply
  3. Melih Avatar
    Melih

    Thanks for the post Maya. @Wissam, this is not politics but a humanitarian duty to not to be silent!

    Reply
  4. Thomas Avatar
    Thomas

    As usual, super!

    Reply
  5. Simon Avatar
    Simon

    Oh Maya, you have no idea!!!
    You should see the coverage that act of cowardliness got here in Australia! the TV kept replaying the same clips of soldiers getting beaten over and over and saying that it was all self defence!
    What do u expect when most TV channels are owned by and

    it’s pathetic!

    on a lighter note, i loved your X-RAY depiction! real sweeet… i’m a sucker for black and white 😀

    Reply
    1. Simon Avatar
      Simon

      OOPS, typo!! got my links all wrong, i meant
      “..owned by Rupert Murdoch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rupert_Murdoch#Australia) and James Packer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Packer)”

      I won’t try to be all fancy with html tags every again! hehehe

      Reply
  6. propaganda » Twitter Trends

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    Reply
  7. Hezi Avatar
    Hezi

    I stumbled across this page, and I felt I had to react.
    I am also a sucker for black-n-white, but the world has sometimes shades of gray. In the greater sense, the self defence was actually preformed by Israel to prevent ship carrying missiles and rockets reaching the hands of Hamas (Not necessarily this aid ship, but once the blockade would be removed, the next one can insert any kind of cargo, completely an suprivised).
    This ship had to be stopped, and I am sorry for the lives that it took.
    Hezi, from Israel.

    Open your eyes

    Reply
    1. darine Avatar
      darine

      Paranoia, self defense and pre-emptive strikes are all different worlds. And to those who say it is self defense, self defense does not always have to be in the face of force, that is what diplomacy is for.

      Reply
    2. Jad Avatar
      Jad

      Hi Hezi,

      My comment will not be about defending the flotilla or the activists or anything but from an international law perspective, what Israel did was against the law because the convoy was still in international water. This is the least thing anyone can say. Apart from commenting on using live ammunition, this is not obviously not a self defense because simply if you were attacked in international water by anyone, at least you have the right to defend yourself!

      Reply
      1. Jad Avatar
        Jad

        Sorry for the typo!

        Hi Hezi,

        My comment will not be about defending the flotilla or the activists or anything but from an international law perspective, what Israel did was against the law because the convoy was still in international water. This is the least thing anyone can say. Apart from commenting on using live ammunition, this is obviously not a self defense because simply if you were attacked in international water by anyone, at least you have the right to defend yourself!

    3. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
      HommusBetheeneh

      bayyac

      Reply
      1. Ahmad Osman Avatar
        Ahmad Osman

        And by no virtue is this a way to hold a decent argument. This is what you say when you have nothing to say. It is people with your sense of argumentation who make this nation the weakling that it is.

      2. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        Israeli are Israeli. You don’t cannot have a decent conversation with any, they’re terrorists and savages, no compromise and leniency whatsoever shall be given when talking to them, NO interaction must exist in the first place. KHALAS they’re out! And habeebe don’t blow of your steem 3layye okkk?!

      3. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        I have nothing to say, exctly, I am NOT like those darn BEDWIN Arabs whose soul action is producing a stinking paper or a statement entitled “nashjob wa noudeen wa nastanker…” I HAVE nothing to say, I don’t. You fight a flame with a flame. To hell with virtue, I have virtue, but when dealing with a rapist, a pedofile, a slaughter, virtue, selection of words and decent deportment shall be the last things on your mind, buddy.

      4. Ahmad Osman Avatar
        Ahmad Osman

        This is all you are doing right now: you are tachjoub wa toudine, and this is all you are ever doing by posting a comment on a website that is not even yours. You are like those ‘Bedwin’ (your erred spelling, not mine) Arabs so long as you are not doing anything real, and by ‘real’ I mean getting off of your laptop or computer and getting into a demonstration, or fishing a biased coverage on BBC and sending them an e-mail telling them that their bias is not going unwatched, or at least boycotting. Whatever you do here, it is nothing but tachjoub wa toudine.

        I, too, am doing just that, but at least I hold no pretense to doing otherwise, like you are, and at least I do it with efficiency.

      5. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        Where did I “ashjob wa oudeen”?! Please take a look at my post, the one you got so frenzied about, and at my other two posts. And excuse my rather bad English! Enno ba3ed na2es!! If I committed a spelling error so be it! I am here to express my opinion, an opinion that stands being expressed in any way, any style, any format, rife with errors or impeccable. So don’t shower me with your fancy English vocabulary, and cut the bragging. I got ballistic over this ignorant Israeli person and threw something at him, it’s like like I’m the only one that did so. And pardon me for not being classy and up to your level, sir.

    4. Ahmad Osman Avatar
      Ahmad Osman

      Hezi, I will go with your logic on the blockade being there to prevent arms from getting into the hands of Hamas.

      By this same logic, a serious blockade will have to be set on Israel, because obviously the arms that have been getting to Israel have been used to commit all sorts of crimes and atrocities, all of which, if I may add, have been going unsanctioned by the International Community, and therefore in defiance to International Law and its most basic pillars.

      The arms getting into the hands of Israel have been used to support an apartheid regime that shocks the conscience of humanists and secularists, and that is – to say the least – outdated in the 21st Century.

      You tell me that Hamas is also based on religion, and is as such far from secularism, and that is true, and I will not refer here to the argument whereby Hamas is an organisation of self-defence, because self-defence is all too amorphous and was bastardised by the Israeli rhetoric itself, but I will tell you two things:

      1. Whatever crimes Hamas commits, Hamas is condemned for, whereas this does not apply for the Israeli apartheid regime.
      2. Hamas, and Islamic extremism as a whole, came as a reaction to Zionist ideology, not the other way around: Israel was established as a Jewish state in 1948, Hamas as an Islamic organisation during the first Intifada in 1987.

      Reply
      1. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        had power and time for only one comment today. will continue tommorow..

        “By this same logic, a serious blockade will have to be set on Israel”
        Israel is a sovereign state, therefore it is entitled to have arms in order to defend itself, the same as any other state in the world. The PA legal status is that it is not a state. It is an Authority, it was agreed upon on 1995. The authority is supposed to have enough weapons just to help it control its own pupolation. One of the reasons Israel insisted on this point is that we here feared that any weapons we allow the PA, will eventually be fired on us. The year is 2010. I don’t need to how many missiles we suffered since.
        Don’t get me wrong. I have no problem with the Plastinians declaring themself as a state, and start arming themselves as much as they want as long as they don’t use these weapons against me. As I said before, our problem is with the Hamas, who refused in the past to publically agree to the international treaties signed between Israel and the PA, and Israel right to exist. What should I think about a group that doesn’t want me in the region, and trys to arm itself?

        On a side note, Israel have a tough time discussing issues with the Palestinians, because they don’t have a clear leader. It was hard to achieve the treaty in 1995, and 10 later a new group comes and completely rejects these agreements. In addition, even agreement that were signed are not honored, because the Palestinians can enforce order on all the inner groups that there are among them. The same goes to the situation on the border in Lebanon in 2006. We feel that we withdrew from Lebanon because UN officials came and mark the border between the countries. So why do a group inside Lebanon who decided that they don’t like the agreement are kidnapping our soldiers completely unprovoked? Why cant the Lebanese goverment take control of this group of people who live inside them? If this is what happening with Lebanon which is relatively stable state, what will happen in the Palestine state when it will come?

        “The arms getting into the hands of Israel have been used to support an apartheid regime…”
        There is no apartheid.
        from wikipedia: “system of legal racial segregation enforced by the National Party government”.
        We are no longer in Gaza, and there is the PA which is controling the people in the west bank. so who are segragating? In Camp David Summit in July 2000 yassar arafat 94% of the west bank (see in wikipedia) and he refused. He prefered a second Intifaeda. Had he agreed, there might not be a need for any Palestinian to ever see an Israeli soldier ever again. But he refused on you know the rest of story.

        Again on a side note. In 1947, our leader, david ben gurion had to cope with a similiar problem, when the UN offer for the jewish partition wasnt as big as he hoped for. But he was pragmitist, and he had a vision that to be free is more important than controlling a peace of land.

        “You tell me that Hamas is also based on religion”
        I didn’t say any thing about hamas being a religious group. I have no problem with that. What makes religion to be bad, is the people that practice it. religion gave humanity very good things such as the commandments and the laws. religion on the other hand gave humanity a lot of very bad things such as crusades and a lot of wars on a religious background, and I might add that even the fact that arafat didn’t agree in july 2000 is because he didn’t want to “surrender Jerusalem”. What is that if not a religious act.

  8. Break the Siege!! Avatar
    Break the Siege!!

    Based on Hezi’s reasoning, the Global boycott (and blockade) of Israel is legitimate because Israel has been murdering and killing Palestinians and Arabs since before 1948
    To support this boycott, join us here: http://www.breaksiege.com/get in touch with transport and dock workers and unions in all countries to inform them directly to pursue the successful boycott of Israel. The Swedes have started.

    Reply
  9. TY Avatar
    TY

    Nazi, oops I mean Hezi (typing mistake),
    did you just write “self defence” (btw it is defense not defence)? you have to be kidding me! I mean seriously!
    Sorry (not really) this post did upset you, and you “had to react”, and how cool from you to give us an advice to “open our eyes” (3an jad thx).
    But obviously you are so tense and you need to relax, so “open your ears”:
    – get a printer (inkjet, laser, it doesn’t really matter)
    – print your lovely comment in black and white and keep the shades of gray
    – print another copy. repeat till when you have around 15 copies.
    – roll all the papers together, to form a thick cylinder.
    – shove it up your ass.

    Reply
  10. Mohannad El-Khairy Avatar
    Mohannad El-Khairy

    Hezi, your softish (gray) approach to posting this comment does more than good. This was NOT self-defesne by the Israeli commandos. This was a cold blood murder of innocent people. The Zionist strategy of playing the innocent victime card no long works. Strop it. I know the organizers of the Free Gaza Movement very well. They are Israelis, Palestinians, Brits, French, Turks, Greeks, and a dozen other nationalities that have worked together to break the illegal Israeli blockade on Gaza. Some of them are Holocaust survivors. Do you realize your own gvt was attacking Holocaust survivors?? One of them is an ex-US Marine from USS Liberty (the American ship that was attacked by Israel in 1967). You had kids, babies as young as 1 year old on whom one commando pointed his weapon on to demand the halting of the ship! (http://ow.ly/1Tukj) What kind of “defense” is that? For a blockade to be legal under int’l maritime law, it must be approved by the Security Council. The Gaza blockade was NOT approved by the SC. A blockade does not legitimize the boarding of a flotilla ship in international waters when the blockade itself is considered illegal. And EVEN if soldiers were attacked, when you have three waves of attacks, shots being fired at you, and commandos boarding the ship, what would YOU do? Wouldn’t you grab anything that’s infront of you and fight back? (http://bit.ly/9n57RT) None of these ships were carrying missiles and rockets to reach the hands of Hamas. That’s preposterous for God’s sake. And whilst the Palestinian people elected Hama to lead it, there is a reason why they were elected: Your Occupation and Your Governments puppet regime in Ramallah. Look at the root causes of the situation. The flotillas are not linked to Hamas nor Iran. They represent 40+ nations including politicians from Europe. And if they were, then why did Israel release them? It’s worth noting that Israel hasnt declared war on Hamas or Gaza because it would have to legally comply with international rules of engagement and thus treat Gazans more humanely than it does now. So you’re not sorry for the lives that were lost. If you truly were, you would be out in the streets condemning your gvt’s murder with the rest of the globe and the real Jews of Conscience currently renouncing Zionism as Racism: http://mohannadelkhairy.blogspot.com/2009/07/jews-of-conscience.html
    Hezi, from Israel.

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      Regarding the legitimity of the blockade and the inspection of the flotilla see my post below.
      Yes, probably the majority of the floatilla where innocent people, with a true will to help the people in Gaza. And yes, some of them where babies, women, ex-us marine, holocaust survivors and even a member in the israel parlament (she is not really popular here right now, btw). All these innocent people probably didn’t participate in the bashing of our soldiers that happened on the upper deck by a group of militants who where well prepared and well armed to the encounter with our soldiers. And yes, a knife, iron bar, bats or axes used correctly CAN kill. So is throwing a soldier 10 feet down from upper deck to lower deck. All these bashing and stubing that happened can be seen in youtube, some of it was filmed by the passengers themself and was brodcasted live.
      Given that Israel had the right to block the ship (again see my post below), the situation is the same as if an armed policeman asks you to stop for inspection. You probably don’t take its pistol and starts shotting at him. If you do, don’t be suprised that he is firing back.
      Israel have no problem with the palestinian people. Israel has a problem with the palastinian leadership, which refuses to agree on the right of Israel to exist. I remind you that we have withdrawn from Gaza, and yet, Hamas continued to fire rockets and missiles on our cities. Will you sit quiet while rockets are falling on you cities?

      Reply
  11. Ash Avatar
    Ash

    Hezi.. i never saw anyone who is rude as you, but i guess you are used to see and live with people like you, as you come from a country that it’s rude enough to justify its actions as “self defense”.
    and our eyes is opened already as we can see the massacre that happened in Ghaza by your poor wronged harmless people.

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      and I can you show you photages and videos of my people, also civilians, also innocents, that where killed by suicide-bomb or missiles or rockets.

      We withdrew from Lebanon in 2000. We have no business there. What do we get? 4 kidnapped soldiers and thousands of missiles fired all over our northern boarder, including a major city Haifa.
      We withdrew from Gaza. We have no business there. What do we get? 1 kidnapped soldier (that the red cross is not allow to visit) and thousand of missiles fired all over our southern boarder.
      Can you promise me that if we remove the blockade no arment will be passed? no arment will used against us again? I certainly don’t want the blockade, and I wish that the people of Gaza would be able to live a happy and prosperous life. But the people of Gaza decided to elect the Hamas, which refuses to accept Israel has a right to exist, and activily acts to destroy us. If the people of Gaza wants the blockade to be lift all they have to do is to go to their leaders and tell them to free Gilad Shalit our occupied soldier and to publicly announce that they accept Israel right to exist (as Saadat did in 73).
      You would be suprised how far Israel would be willing to go if such declaration would be made.

      Reply
      1. Ash Avatar
        Ash

        hahahaha what a funny reply u did!! 1 kidnapped soldier poor u guys, and for that 1 soldier you kill people not even Palestinians!! 200 of them!! u r mad for you’re kidnapped soldiers and we can’t be mad for the thousands of people your people killed!!
        and everyone knows that if you people got your soldier back nothing gonna happen ’cause its in your blood!!
        a soldier kidnapped, the sad story of the poor Jews!! write a book about that and do something useful instead of your crap opinion.
        just a comment about what did you write to HommusBetheeneh: put your self in our shoe and what do you think about seeing your land being taking from you and your kids being killed!!
        How rude you people became is impressive!!

      2. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        Ash, you have to understand that our people were killed too, first in wars again the arab country, later by freedom fighters from PLO, hezbulla and hamas, and that only 2 years ago 40% of the country was bombarded by missiles and rockets. It was just pure luck that the cities were partially evacuated, that there were no severe causulties in our side.
        I do not agree with the term that you used “land being taken”. the origin of the israel-arab-palestinian conflict is not from today. it started over 100 years ago, and since than both sides have done mistakes and many lives were lost on both sides. I am open to hear your suggestion on how this conflict can be solved.
        With respect,
        Hezi

      3. Ash Avatar
        Ash

        well. as you can see this is an endless discussion. you only look at it from your point of perspective.
        and don’t compare the number of innocent people who were killed by your people and the small number comparing to that from you people!
        and I don’t want to start talking about Al-Qasa mosque and how that you trying to destroy it.
        you’re telling me that you don’t like the term “land being taking”, are serious??? I have relatives from the west bank who their lands been taken without any reason so you people can build new ares on it. where is justice here? isn’t that called stealing lands from Palestinian people? or is that called mercy that you just was satisfied by only taking the land and killing its owners, where some times your soldiers do!
        you want suggestion. start by giving some rights for the Palestinian and give the poor people their lands back. and just have enough with the lands that you have now.

      4. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        “as you can see this is an endless discussion.”

        I hope that the discussion of the dispute will end one day, but for that to happen, both sides needs to want it to end. This is not the first and only dispute in the world. There are some other places in the world were disputes have been ended with compromizes. It is up to us to decide whether we wants to be North Ireland or Bosnia.

        “don’t compare the number of innocent people who were killed by your people and the small number comparing to that from you people!”

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_casualties_of_war

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_casualties_of_war

        even when considering “Black September in Jordan”, “Lebanese Civil War”, “War of the camps”, were israel was only partially involved in your loses, the ratio is about 2:1. without them it is closer to 1:1, slightly more on your side.

        few thoughts:

        – What do you think would have happened to the death toll If Israel didn’t kills a suicide bomber on his way to his martyrdom? Some suicide bombers were very successful at killing us jews, maybe even to a ratio of 20:1.

        – Continuing on the same thought: you try to slap a martial artist master 100 times. 99 times he stops you and slap you back. only 1 in 100, you succeed in hitting him. Israel is (as to today) better militarily equipped than you. 100 times you send suicide bomber, missile rocket launchers, soldiers kidnappers, 99 of them get killed in the process. Who is to blame? the one that sends them or the one that killed them?

        – Another thought: Imagine a parallel universe, were in the last “Gaza war” one of the missile hit a full kindergarden with 30 babies. this scenario almost happened in Beer Sheva, it was avoided because the mayor of Beer-Shave decided to continue the evacuation for one more day. Do you understand that this could have been your Qana mistake?

        – The plastenian are the ones that set the “casualties ratio” by asking 900 of your freedom fighters in exchange of 1 Israeli soldier. so maybe the ratio should have been 900:1 and not 2:1. You are the ones that have no dignity to human life, exploiting human wicknesses in order to send people to their sure, martyrdom, death. I sure hope for them that there are so many virgins in heaven..

        – What ratio will satisfy you? 1:1? 1:2? 1:3? How many more lives should be lost in order for you to understand that all these killing are completely unnecessary, and the only people that lose from it are us the common people, and not the governments that sends us.

        – To end this post in an optimistic thought: This is not the only dispute that exists or ever existed in the world. US-Germany were involved in a huge war only 70 years ago and now they are huge friends. France and England were involved in a 100 years war in the 14 century. Not all disputes has to end with the complete destruction of the other side.

        After thinking all these happy thoughts, I am going to sleep my peaceful night sleep.

        Good night

        Hezi

      5. Ash Avatar
        Ash

        discussing you thoughts!!

        – its not about the ratio and how many people were killed. which i believe that number is not all right for the Palestinian number who were killed! we’re not only talking about the number of people we’re killed.
        how many lands were taking with no rights from Palestinians! how many families slept on the streets for months because u decided to build a war and take people’s land!

        – “almost bombed a kinder-garden” haha how many kids and babies and students at their classes were killed!! because they through a stone on a metal heavy Jeep that bullets can’t go through it! is that protecting soldiers life!! is stripping women on the streets right for you?

        – and about you became friends with the German! Hezi they killed the Jews and kicked you all out from their country and sent to Palestine then they felt bitty for you all and then you all became friends.
        Is this the way you want to be friends with Palestinian people? do you want all to be kicked out from their lands for good?
        didn’t you ask yourself that these people all needs a land to live on. in their houses on their lands!
        give them the right to live in peace, then all these Suicide bombers will stop and live to see their kids live in peace.

      6. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        I apperciate your thoughts. This is going to be long…

        “its not about the death ratio.. it is also about the land..u decided to build a war ”
        I actually feel sad that land is maybe more important to you than the life of your own people. Land is important, I admit. But how much land do you really need in order to live a decent life? I can already see your next question: if land is not so important than why are you expansioning? I will answer you: in 1948 Israel didn’t seek to expand. If back than we were left in peace, Israel would have stayed the same size in land I assure you.
        We are, at least the majority of our people (I will get to that in a bit), not expansionist by nature. but since 1948 we were attacked by the arab countries surroundings us and also by Palestinian. Israel seazed additional land only because it was looking for a way to stop these attacks. since 1977 Israel is a process of CONTRACTION: Sinai, Lebanon, West bank, Gaza. Yes, we didn’t not fully withdrew from Gaza and the left bank, but this is not because we want to control you or exploit your land. It is because Israel wishs to be safe, and since you continue with the attacks, we just have to continue control the land. It is our survival instinct. We are searching for a defendable border for our state, because we know that having a state is more important to us than land.
        There is however a minority Jews group in Israel which have an expansion desire based on their religon belief that the land was promised to Jews. These people had a way of getting funds and support from many goverments to help their cause. We now treat these people with mixed emotions. They are part of our people, we understand their enthusiasm, but we know that it might not be good for us. The settlements in west bank are a lot harder to dismantle. There are a lot more of them. This is the status Quo right now, whether we like it or not. The future of these settlements was already negotiated in the peace process. but you chose to stop the peace process so they stayed and maybe even increased. The more time will pass, the harder it will be to solve the settlement issue.
        Someone here asked me: if Abu Mazen is not attacking, why are we not removing the road blocks in the west bank. My answer is that it is a process. It will come. But in order to do so we have to be sure that Abu Mazen is able to seize control over that piece of land. We don’t want to withdraw and face attacks in the future (like in Gaza after disengagement. like suicude bombs from west bank after oslo), which might mean that we will need to seize it again in the future. All these withdrawing and battling to seize back is what is causing most of the casualities. When we withdraw there is chaos, and life is lost, and we have to use massive force to get it back, which means more deaths and more pain for both sides.
        You can’t also compare the west bank to Gaza, because it much closer to the heart of Israel, and attacks on the heart are much more dangerous. I think that Abu Mazen himself knows that he is not capable of promising us that he can control the people. last time we gave the PLO a terittory, PLO lost it to hamas, and from what I read it seems that PLO is continuing to lose power in the people and will probably suffer another blow in the next elections.

        You probably won’t like my next analogy, but I am gone to say it anyway. In a way you can compare the Israel-Palestinain situation to a Parent-child relations. Israel, the parent, is feeding the Palestinians (Israel still provides you food, electicity, money), we don’t like when you hang around with the neighbourhood thug (Iran). punishing you when you miss-behave, even inflict you pain when you are going really out of line. And you, the child, don’t understand why we are hurting him. Well, that’s because you don’t see the whole picture. We are waiting for you to grow up and be INDEPENDENT (Mohannad El-Khairy, you asked me in June 3 about it, now I can answer you), a normal state among all the other states, side by side next to Israel, indepndent to find its own way in the world, hoping that the grown son will not come and hurt the parent. I am sorry if this analogy offended anyone. If so, know that it was not my intension.

        – “almost bombed a kinder-garden…”
        Cant add a lot here. Already said that Israel and the Palestinians, after arafat declined the peace talks in 2000, are in a state of low-level confrontation. We are sorry for any life lost, even from your side, but we feel that it is necessary for our safety. If you had accepted the negotiations in 2000, there was no need for most Palestinians to see any Israel soldier, there were no need for any road block or searching women. I must add, that again, you are the ones that hold a part blame in the security measures that we need to do. Don’t want your women to be searched? don’t send weapon and bomb with them, keep them out of the game. want a quick passage for ambulance? don’t use it to hide weapons and move them around. Don’t want your hospitals, schools and kindergarden be bombarded? don’t hide there weapons. If you are a parent in Gaza and you sent your child to a kindergarden that has a bombs in the basement, don’t send your child there. If you witness an ambulance loaded with bombs and you don’t say anything about it trying to stop it, then don’t be surprised that when you need it, you will be stoppen by a road block.
        I am sure that it is not as simple as I am saying it. resisting against operations like these is going against the leadership which supports them. It can even be dangerous. Could it be that this is why you don’t have your own Ilan Pappe? Human are not all created the same, I don’t think that it is possible that everybody thinks the same things. If you cant show me at least one person in the whole arab world that oppose the main stream thinking, then I can think of two reasons: fear of what will happen to you if you go against the controlling force, or that that you are not getting all the information.

        – “and about you became friends with the German!”
        Yes, but we have decided to let go of the past so we can build a better future. Hopefully we will able to do it too with you. it is not the first time in history that enemies has became friends (US -RUSSIA just a few years ago is good example). we are all humans, we all live here on the same planet, we should find a way live here together.

        “didn’t you ask yourself that these people all needs a land to live on. in their houses on their lands!”
        I have news for you. Israelies and Palestinians are already living here together on the same space between Jordan and the sea. This means that either want to kick us out of here so you will have the whole place to your own, or that change that you are asking is about HOW we are going to live here. Just to finish the post on an optimistic note, I want to enhance my point that land shouldn’t be the real issue here. Here is a link to what can be done with a little vision when you don’t have enough space:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lg9qnWg9kak

        Hezi

      7. Ash Avatar
        Ash

        You know how to write, and you have a very good way to persuade someone with your ideas. but the problem here that most of what you say don’t make sense!!
        like you’re talking about living together in peace and sharing the land in Palestine. I’m not against that, no for real! but what are you saying is just the same thing you’re “parent” is saying: “we are protecting our self by taking everyone’s land and we think when we do that Palestinians will be OK with it and stop attacking us we the poor Jews!! and they will be OK with living in the start and that will cool them down”

        what an example you gave to picture the whole thing. do you read what you write before posting! are you really serious! you give Palestinians food. very generous of you! you think that these people that you orphans living homeless in the streets need you Jews to feed them! you think who lost a child need to be fed and that he cant grow and make his own food! shame on you to give such an example.

        You think that the problem is the land! the problem became the issue here when people were kicked out of it and who used to live on it were killed with no rights. Do you think that these people will sacrifice the life of their child to hide bombs! didn’t you think that these people is protecting these kids in the first place! that’s what you think and I know you know that this is not possible but this is the image you want to show the work. exactly what Maya meant by “Flotillusion”

      8. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        -“Do you think that these people will sacrifice the life of their child to hide bombs”
        Ash, I don’t know about you , but I wouldn’t sent my child (not that I have any) to this school:
        Hamas booby traps in a school during Gaza War:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_EztCN3ODk

        And I won’t leave in this neighbourhood:
        http://archive.arabnews.com/?page=4&section=0&article=115346&d=12&m=10&y=2008
        The one is Saudi site. I don’t know it, I just look for “hamas bomb in house” and it was one of the first links.

        There are more links like these. I know that I can find photos of houses were hamas military hided weapon. it was the tactics used by hamas preparing for the Gaza war. In houses, in a civilian neighbourhood. This is guerilla tactics, and this tactics is causing your side to suffer more casualties during war.

        I understand your anger. But You automatically defend the your side and you don’t see that your tactics are working also against you. The same is true in our side: sometimes our ideas aren’t so smart (boarding a marmara with paintball for example), but at least I admit it. Your side is not an angel.

        I am sorry for the food example. I know that you know h0w to grow your own food. The purpose of the analogy was to explain what independence is.
        Do you think that Palestinian can be independent today? then why don’t you go ahead and declare yourself as such? I almost certain that after some thinking Israel will decide to see how it goes and not take military actions.

        We are no longer in Gaza. Had you continued the peace process, we probably wouldn’t be in the west bank too, and we wouldn’t control the air and sea in Gaza. You keep saying that the problem is that we kicked you out. The status quo today is that we are here. What is your solution. I want to know, because it sounds to me that you really want me to go back to where we came from. Well, some Jews here have no where to go. They didn’t come from europe. They came from arab states. Do you think they will be able to go back? I was born in Israel, but my father is from Romania. His family was forced waive all their property when they left Romania. He has no other passport other the Israeli passport. We can’t simply go back to Romania, because I am no longer a citizen there. There are some who might find a way to escape when you will kick us out, but what will you do with the millions that will have to stay here? put us in Gaza? what will you do when OUR freedom fighters start attacking you from there?

        Please let me know what is your solution

        Hezi

    2. Ash Avatar
      Ash

      I know that you here now, and lets face and be realistic for a moment; Jews will stay in Palestine and no one can simply kick the Jews out! and you live here in Palestine no argue with that. but don’t you think that for the west bank that you took others land, I mean u Jews have your own land right! why you keep taking more lands and kicking people from their houses???

      A solution is to give Palestinian who you came and took their lands some rights. be satisfied with the lands you already have. give people rights to live.
      give Palestinians rights to go to Al-Aqsa Mosque, instead of trying to turn it down.

      don’t be selfish and start feeling with others.

      Reply
  12. Hezi Avatar
    Hezi

    Since it was created (by UN resulotion on 1947), the 5 million people of Israel had been attacked time after time by the hostile +200 million people in the surronding states. So yes, in the wars there were casualties. From both sides, by the way. I wish there weren’t.
    Remeber that only a year ago Palestinians shot missiles on major cities in Israel, and it was then that the UN, in another resulotion, allowed inspection of goods to Gaza carried by air, sea, or land ( The same had happened in the US-Cuba missile crisis in 1963).
    Jad, once there is a blockade, and there is a ship explicitly saying that they are trying to break it, Israel has the right to stop it even if it is in international waters. It is in the international law, check it for yourself. and btw, a ship trying to break a blockade is considered to be performing an agressive attack. It is in the international law, check it for yourself.
    Israel (and Eygpt , who is also enforcing the blockade btw) offered time and time again to allow the aid to pass to Gaza after being inspected for arms. This offered was rejected, probably because the reason for flotilla was to break the blockade so next ship could carry missiles and just aid. The aid is on its way to Gaza as we speak, after it was inspected.
    In respect of all the above, Israel had no other way other than to stop the flotilla. 5 out of 6 ships did not resist, but the 6th ship was something completely different. On that ship , among the 600 passengers, there was a small group of people whose aim was to kill or kidnap our soldiers as can be seen in the many videos on youtube. Some of them confessed there will to become martirs (also in youtube). Our soldiers boarded the ship with paintball rifles, and began shoting live fire only after realizeing that their life was in real danger.
    Put yourself in a one of our soldier’s position. I bet you would have done the same. Luckily for you you you don’t leave in Israel, and you don’t have to face these problems.

    TY, nice insults.

    Reply
    1. Simon Avatar
      Simon

      Hezi! mate! you gotta be kidding me… did you seriously say that you guys are lucky because we don’t have to face these problems? do u realise that you’re talking to Lebanese and Palestinians here???
      Dude, it’s Gaza that’s being blockaded and not freaking israel! it’s the palestenians that are putting up with ur murder and kicking them out of them homes and you have the decency to say you don’t face these problems?

      man i can’t argue with ignorance! is that how u get urself to sleep at night? by ignoring all the destruction and killing done by ur government and believing that they had it coming? after all, the land was promised to you!

      You’re kicking pple from their homes, demolishing families, and when they attack in self-defense you have the audacity to scream foul and kill them in “self-defence”???

      why should their be a blockade to start with? have u ever asked urself that before? have u ever wondered who’s land ur living on?

      listen mate, i admire you courage to comment here, even if it was driven by ignorance and stupidity… just don’t come here thinking you weren’t gonna face insults… (not that i’m insulting u as a person! but as an israeli citizen… actually i haven’t insulted u)

      Reply
      1. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        Wlak abou rabba Simon 😀 haha

      2. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        Hi Simon. mate.
        No. I wasn’t aware who is on this site. It doesn’t matter to me. I just want you to hear my side of the story, so maybe you will understand that there are people in here too. This is what so beautiful in the net today, that people all over the world can talk to each other so everybody can see that people on the other side may not seeing the same things.
        As I replied to Ash: We withdrew from Lebanon and Gaza, and we still got attacked by missiles. What do you expect Israel do to? This is way we see a need for the blockade. Put yourself in our shoes for a minute and you would understand that we had no other choice.

    2. Rawan Avatar
      Rawan

      Well.. I just feel sorry for you Hezi, it seems you have been brainwashed !!! Wish you were a bit smarter to actually stand up for your government and OPEN YOUR EYES to the atrocities it is committing to the children and the innocent citizens of Gaza. I mean I guess you’re right, these children deserve to die or live in misery just because they are born Palestinians, while you get to enjoy life!! and you say we’re the lucky ones. I think you should go try living there for a day -no not even a day- an hour, and then come back and tell me who are the lucky ones!
      Oh yeah and i can’t but remember the beautiful gifts the kids from your country sent to the “terrorist” children of Lebanon during the July 06 war, it was really thoughtful, I mean very beautiful and full of “love”. No words can explain.
      Next time you think on commenting and defending your government’s acts, just do yourself a favor and think again!

      Reply
    3. Jad Avatar
      Jad

      Hezi,

      I checked myseld and this might help you, please bring some international links if you want to justify back, not an Israeli IDF site:

      http://www.guardian.co.uk/law/afua-hirsch-law-blog/2010/jun/01/gaza-freedom-flotilla-international-law

      http://bigthink.com/ideas/20345

      Once again, it’s not a matter of law war because -as you probably know- Israel ignored tons of UN resolutions regarding the Palestinian issue out of ” I can’t even imagine why” (this might help you http://www.mediamonitors.net/michaelsladah&suleimaniajlouni1.html) So maybe it’s not a matter of international law here because Israel itself ignored it so many times!

      It’s quite obvious and there’s no need to keep denying it, a lot of Israeli Human Rights activists are questioning the arrogance and inhumane acts of the IDF and the government recently. A simple comparison between the number of Palatinate & Israeli civilians killed in latest clashes proofs that. A Jewish holocaust survivor joined the convoy btw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unjQOGie5Vg&feature=player_embedded) and that’s a very clear proof that Jewish people reached a level of boredom of the current Israeli state actions and acting to show the world that Jewish people themselves are in a state of awakening. Please look at the facts again and try to be one of them! This is a new era and It’s not a matter of wiping Israel out of the map as you might think. It’s a matter of arrogance and stupidity in the current government controlled by some radicals.

      Reply
      1. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        Hi Jad.

        From your own link:

        “Israel has already argued that its actions could not be regarded as piracy because it did not commit any crime when boarding the vessels, and experts …”.
        This is what we claim. There is a blockade on Gaza (like it or not), and a vessel has tried to break it. We are entitled to examine it.
        Israel had tried to suggest alternative ways to pass the aid to Gaza, but was rejected. The loss of the 9 lives on board was not massacre, it was an act of self defense (with ‘s’ this time), because the soldiers felt that there lives where at stake. Watching the videos on youtube I don’t blame them. I would have defend my life also in that situation. If an innocent civilians (babies, women, us-ex-marine, holocost surviver) had been killed from a bullet, aimed not at him but at the man with the knife next to him, I would have said: “tough for him”. He should not have been there in the first place. By staying on a ship that you know that is going to attempt breaking a blockade, this person should had known that his life could be in jeopardy.

        The fact of the matter is that whether the boarding on board the Marmara, even in international waters, is legitimate should be dealt by experts. Believe me when I tell you Israel checked the legality issues involved BEFORE it went to this operation. Israel believes that it can defend it right to do so even in an open international investigation. I am no expert, so I must believe that my leaders know what they are doing. We can continue argue about the legitimity of the act of boarding the vessel, and I can probably finds some links that can back up my point up here, but this is what I meant in an earlier post that things are no so “black-n-white”. You may feel that you are on the right side, but so do I.

        btw, the fact that there are some Israelies that are opposing our goverment could not be used against us. Israel is a democratic country. People here are free-thinkers, and they are entitiled (with limits) to say and do whatever they want. So in a country with 6 million people there might be some who are opposing the goverment, we have no problem with it.

        Israel is sorry for the excesive lose of life in past clashes in Lebanon and in Gaza and on the Marmara. But these are situations of war and in war people get killed. You don’t like it? don’t start it. The number of innocents deaths in Gaza and Lebanon got bigger because Hamas and Hezbulla has a tendency to use civilians as human shields. The Qana case mentioned before, was because civilians where too close to a place where Hezbulla fired rockets on Israel (around 100 meters). There were alomost no Israelies casualties because we evacuted third of our country. I personally housed a friend who lives near the border for a month during that time. Would you feel any better if there where equal number of deaths on both side?

  13. ragi Avatar
    ragi

    very good drawings and ideas
    thank you

    Reply
  14. Mohannad El-Khairy Avatar
    Mohannad El-Khairy

    You are misinformed and therefore misinforming people. Israel did NOT have 5 million people in 1948; they constituted roughly 30% of the entire population pre-Israel’s declaration of independance/pre-Palestine’s Nakba. And that was after mass manipulative/forced immigration from Europe and surrounding Arab nation. When Israel declared “independence” (independance from what I still have no clue), it was the tri-lateral alliance of the West, Zionism and corrupt Arab regimes under British/French rule that came to CONSOLIDATE borders of the new state of Israel. You are taught that 5 Arab armies came to “throw the Jews into the Sea”. That is a lie used to brainwash you and your people, in line with thousands of other “security”/”safety” obssessed propaganda (it’s almost like a paranoid mantra in Israeli society). Let’s be clear about one thing: in 1948 Arab armies “attacked” for their personal gains not for the sake of Palestine. The whole thing had been cooked up to serve the political elitist establishments, consolidate their hold on power, and fill their pockets with arms sales revenues and the profits of war.

    When it comes to Palestinian rockets being fired into southern Israel, allow me to just say that Israel helped the creation of Hamas in the 70s to counter the increasing influence of the secular PLO movememt (this has been documented by the president of the Israeli League for Human and Civil Rights Israel Shahak, in his book “Jewish History/Jewish Religion (page 7 if I remember well). It is a microcosm of the USA/Muhahideen scenario in Afghanistan. So when you oppress an entire nation for 60+ years, and deprive them from their human rights, the result is the election of right-wing crazies like Hamas. And when Hamas sends rockets into Israel, then understand that it is your government’s policies that have planted the seeds. You reap what you sow. Feel free to look into another more realistic reason for the Israeli massacre on Gaza over a year ago today: Gaza’s natural gas reserves (http://ow.ly/1Tw97 ).

    As mentioned above, for a blockade to be legal under int’l maritime law, it must be approved by the Security Council. The Gaza blockade was NOT approved by the SC. A blockade does not legitimize the boarding of a flotilla ship in international waters when the blockade itself is considered illegal. Israel has no right to have this blockade on Gaza in the first place. Please know the facts of internatinal maritime law before making such ridiculous statements. Check it out for YOURSELF. What you’re doing is political spin-doctoring, typically utilized by Zionists and Zionist apologists. The world is fed up with it.

    “5 out of 6 ships did not resist, but the 6th ship was something completely different. On that ship , among the 600 passengers, there was a small group of people whose aim was to kill or kidnap our soldiers as can be seen in the many videos on youtube. Some of them confessed there will to become martirs (also in youtube). Our soldiers boarded the ship with paintball rifles, and began shoting live fire only after realizeing that their life was in real danger”. First, NONE of the ships resisted. At 4am the first ship was attacked BEFORE the commandos boarded the ship. And white flags were being waived. It is only when the solders boarded the ship and started shooting heads did people start defending themselves. The real question is: Would you allow yourself to be shot at when you have nothing to protect yourself with, or would you defend yourself by any means necessary? And anyway, I thought Israel prided itself on the “professionalism” and “skill” of its army. Surely if they were and their lives were in danger, they could/would have planned this better. They could have shot them in the arm or leg, not in the head as the article in my last post shows. You know why they didn’t? Because Israeli soldiers are cowards.

    Egypt is JUST as guilty as Israel. In fact, ALL Arab regimes are guilty. Their silence and inaction are their complicity. What you now have ruling over the Arab world are Arab Zionist apologists: Arab Zionists that submit to a fascist/apartheid/rogue/outlaw/pariah Israeli state via American and European pressure. Another fact is this: the P.A. in the West Bank are Palestininan Zionists as well. So in that respect, you have more supporters than you may think (not all 200 million Arabs). They may have the power, but I guarantee you they do not represent the masses and are therefore a minority. This is not about Israeli/Palestinian or Arab vs.Jew or West vs East. This is about North vs. South (http://ow.ly/1TxpK )

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      Very long post, I cant address it all..

      I am sorry, but for me security is no propoganda. I was in the army and I almost got killed there. My parents live in Beer-sheva, a city which ws hit by missiles only 2 years ago. I live in Tel aviv, a city that only 7 years ago you should have been very careful when you walk in the street because you never know where the next suicide bomber will come. Right now Hamas and Hezbulla might have rockets that can reach Tel aviv so my life is also at danger as we speak.
      So no, for me and for most Israelies, security of my life is an issue. This is the base for everything. This is why there is a need for the blockade (to prevent Hamas from arming, because they have a tendency to use what they have). This is why we boarded the Marmara, and this is why 9 lives got lost.
      The blockade is not intended to starve the people in Gaza. Hell, Gaza, have a border with Eygpt, a nice, huge, arab country. How come you accuse Israel of enforcing a blockade if everything Gaza needs could be delivered through Eygpt? I see a great rage in arab people against Israel on this matter, but I don’t see the same rage directed toward Eygpt. I found it odd.

      “Egypt is JUST as guilty as Israel”. You said it yourself. How do you accuse the PA of being Zionist I do not understand. Zionism, from wikipedia: “nationalist[1] Jewish political movement”. Don’t you have to be jewish in order to be zionist?

      Reply
  15. mc Avatar
    mc

    oups !!!……….

    Hezi you say:
    “Israel have no problem with the palestinian people. Israel has a problem with the palastinian leadership, which refuses to agree on the right of Israel to exist.”

    Do you realize that it is the palestianian people who is suffering in gaza and not the leaders?
    Do you realise that you are not helping Abbas at all, palestinian are more and more with hamas…. That is what you want???

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      Yes. We are that by placing a blockade on Gaza it is the Palastenian people that are also suffering. I remind you that they are the ones that elected hamas on the first place, so they should have forseen that Israel might not like it.
      Once again, I would say that I don’t have a problem with the hamas as a movement of people. From what I understand the majority of Palastenian elected hamas to fight the corruption that was in the PA. Well here in Israel there is also corruption as you may know, but here we didn’t go and elect an exterme religous jewish group to be our leaders as a result. Instead we deal with the corruption in the legal way through court.
      btw, I have to say that in a way I have to admire hamas. it seems that they are really trying to improve the state of their people, and it may be possible that they are less corrupted than PLO. However, I still do have a problem with the solution that hamas has for the Israeli-Palastinian issue, which is that Israel doesn’t have the right to exist. I also have a problem with that the hamas, being an extereme religon group might force his ideology on the rest of the free minded Palestinians. Extreme religous groups tend to do that, it helps them control the population.

      Reply
  16. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
    HommusBetheeneh

    Two things:

    (1) Quoting Maya: “For 2 days, everyone tweets and blogs heavily about the issue only to completely forget it few days later.” You mean like the ETHIOPIAN airplane?!

    (2) AWESOME post Maya, chapeau bas!

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      The origin of the israeli-arab-palestinian conflict are very long. On the way there have been killings on both sides, so many that, as you said, I don’t even remember this ethiopian airplane, the same as I am sure that I can find some kind of a bomb suicide here in Israel that you wouldn’t remember, even though it happened only a few years ago.
      Remembering the past wrong doing will not solve the conflict. I will be happy to hear you suggestion on how to solve the conflict.
      Hezi

      Reply
      1. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        The ethiopian plane was probably shot down by an american aircraft carrier or one of your fish-boats… direct blow to the Lebanese economy, all people who boarded the plane constituted the backbone of the Lebanese economy… (And some major anti-zionist figures/targets)

      2. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
        HommusBetheeneh

        No offense, Hezi. I do appreciate how you come over here and discuss such matters with a bunch of “enraged” Arabs – me being one, and proud… Although you’re technically an enemy 😀

  17. Mohannad El-Khairy Avatar
    Mohannad El-Khairy

    The fact that you can show us footage of innocent Israelis is PRECISELY my point. Innocent people are being killed on both sides, the majority of which are Palestinians. So to end this, you must look deep within yourself and come to terms with the fact that the very being of the state of Israel is wrong, as we as Palestinians must expose the PA for its wrongness; once that happens a movement like Hamas will no longer be necessary. Rockets and suicide bombs and missiles will vanish. But you must address the root problem.

    You say you withdrew from South Lebanon. You didn’t. You PARTIALLY withdrew from South Lebanon. Please don’t refer to your “withdrawal” because you “have no business there” (as if you ever had any business there). The reason is because your cost-benefit ratio was getting high; had it not been for the Resistance, you would have stayed there. Israel’s goals are expansionary by nature, for “security” purposes of course. You got 4 kidnapped soldiers because you held thousands of Lebanese prisoners without trial. In fact, you continously invade Lebanese airspace and have hundreds of Israeli spies in Lebanon. Respect Lebanon’s sovereignty and you wont have any kidnapped soldiers! You got rockets falling on Haifa…umm…really? Did you forget the massacre you committed in South Lebanon? You don’t recall bombing the UN compound in Qana TWICE? Your memory is very selective it seems.

    You withdrew from Gaza. This is a farce. You STILL control land, water and air space. Since the election of Hamas, you continuously harrassed the regime with incursions and killed Palestinian civilians. THAT’s when Gilat Shalit was kidnapped. In one of your raids in the Strip! I seriously don’t get the logic of you Israelis. When you withdraw, withdraw properly! Respect the people’s basic right to movement.

    If you truly want the people of Gaza to live a happy life, believe me you will realize that if you work together WITH them, WITH the Palestinian People, AGAINST apartheid and racism in Israel, Hamas will be a non-entity. There will be no reason for it exist. You would killed it, because you would have killed the reason for its existence.

    The status quo on the ground is that a Jew has just as much as a right to live in the Holy Land as a Muslim and Christian. We all know we used to co-exist peacefully before. But Zionists from Europe came and changed the game with a supremacist attidue (it was the trend remember during Europe’s colonization of the “3rd world”). No matter, when you guys do wake up and decide to treat Palestinians with respect and dignity, then the Israeli living in the Holy Land will not be kicked out. He’ll have that “right to exist”. One man. One Vote. Free the Palestinian people and give them the justice and equality they deserve, and you’ll free the Israeli people from the psychological equation of fear/security=violence/oppression, that has plagued the Israeli mindset since the birth of its existence.

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      Why will Hamas just “go away, disapper, cease to exist”? Hamas is here to stay. It took the control in Gaza by force killing many of there own people.

      Hamas (from wikipedia) 1988 charter calls for replacing the State of Israel with a Palestinian Islamic state in the area that is now Israel, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip -> I live in Tel Aviv. What will my life be like after Hamas will sieze control over my city? Should I convert to Islam? Should I go back to europe?
      This is my home. I have no other place to go. I was kicked from europe after 6 millions of my people got killed there during WWII. We are here with a UN mandate given to us in 1947. Yes, we expanded since, but part of it is to be blamed on arab side, which continued to attack us, at the beginning as states, later by PLO and now hezbulla and hamas.

      Put yourself in my shoes for just one second and tell me what you would have done differently

      Reply
    2. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      btw, I have a problem with some terms in your post.

      “The status quo on the ground is that a Jew has just as much as a right to live in the Holy Land as a Muslim and Christian. We all know we used to co-exist peacefully before. But Zionists..”

      I think that the jews that you refer to are the ones wearing black cloths and wear a big black hat,

      I don’t look like him.

      You can’t seperate Jewism from Zionism.
      Not all the jews look like the one in the picture. The Jews that came from europe (the zionist jews) between 1945 up until now are still jews even that they don’t look like the man in the picture from the outside.

      and you said it yourself: “The status quo on the ground is that a Jew has just as much as a right to live in the Holy Land as a Muslim and Christian”.

      We have a right to live here. you said it.

      Reply
      1. Hezi Avatar
        Hezi

        oops,
        Had a problem with the link to the picture:
        “http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pictures/view/80574138/”

  18. Sareen Akharjalian Avatar
    Sareen Akharjalian

    It seems you hit a nerve here Maya. Hehe great one! I really hope no one would forget this incident by next week 🙁

    Reply
  19. Global Voices in English » Lebanon: Blogosphere buzzing after Israeli attack on Gaza flotilla

    […] noted by the above caricature of popular blogger, Maya Zankoul, the Lebanese are largely outraged not only by Israel's actions, but international media […]

    Reply
  20. Lebanon: Blogosphere buzzing after Israeli attack on Gaza flotilla :: Elites TV

    […] noted by the above caricature of popular blogger, Maya Zankoul, the Lebanese are largely outraged not only by Israel’s actions, but international media […]

    Reply
  21. Hezi Avatar
    Hezi

    Summary:

    The main issues:
    1) Does Israel have a right to exist? (Yes\No)
    2) Does Israel have a right to blockade Gaza? (Yes\No)
    3) Does Israel have a right to board a ship, in international waters, trying to break the blockade? (Yes\No)
    4) What exactly happened on the Ship? (Massacre\Self Defense)

    My answer to the above are Yes, Yes, Yes and Self defense.

    Israel has a right to exist, therefore it has the right to defend itself from attacks coming from Gaza, who fired rockets on our cities only 2 years ago and are still trying to accumulate weapons. There is no real blockade on Gaza because it has a border with Eygpt, a arab country that should be friendly with the Gaza people. The is no real starvation in Gaza, because Gaza economy gets most of it supplies through tunnels, so there was actually no real need for the aid ship. Life in Gaza is probably not be very convinent, but Plastinian people can only blame themselves. They elected hamas to be their leaders (actually they didn’t, hamas took control by force).
    Whether or not it was legitimate to board the ship is an issue for the international court. Israel certainly feels that it had right to do so, and we will defend our right (I hear now that Turkey wants to sue us. Well, we see have it goes.
    What happened on the ship was no massacare. It was an act of self defense from the soldiers that felt that their life where threatens. Again I will say that if a policeman ask you to stop for inspection and you decide to take his gun and try to kill him, don’t be suprised to see that he trys to defend himself.
    there is a declared naval blockade on Gaza, this was the situation (no matter if it is legitimate or not). Trying to break a blockade, even with an aid vessel, is an act of war. So who is the aggersor?

    Reply
  22. Mohannad El-Khairy Avatar
    Mohannad El-Khairy

    You’re asking me why will Hamas just go away, disapper, cease to exist. Because when you alleviate the Palestinian people and give them freedom, justice, and equality, then they wouldnt need to elect a party like Hamas. Why would Hamas even have to exist? The reason why Hamas exists today is because such groups, usually helped from outside, prey on the less fortunate, the disenfranchized parts societies. Hamas didn’t take over Gaza by force my friend, they were elected in Palestinian elections because they were less “corrupt” than the PA and because they provided social services to the less fortunate people in the OPT. I am definitely no Hamas supporter for many many reasons. But you have understand the root cause of why they exist in order to remove them. That root cause is your governtment’s policies, policies that every single Israeli government has done since the birth of your state. And, I know this may offend you which is not the aim, but it all boils down to what Zionism did to the Palestinian people. Not what it was said out to be, what it did. What Zionism did was literally replace one existence (my people’s existence) with yours. Is this fair?

    Tel Aviv is your home. I’ll say it again. You have the right to be there. After 62+ years I cannot tell an Israeli who’s born and raised there to just pack up and leave. That is all what they know so that’s reality. BUT…you cannot be there and live there at the expense of others. They have to accept that others lived there. We’ve lived there for thousands of years. You were kicked out of Europe because you’re Jewish. That does not mean you can kick a Palestinian because he’s Arab or not Jewish.

    Allow me me put it this way. If person A slaps person B. Do you think it’s right for person B to slap person C? What does person C have to do with it? In fact, person B should know better because he felt what it’s like to be slapped and should know it’s not right. Why go slap someone else? Why slap again in the first place? In this silly/simplified scenario: A=Germany/Europe, B=Zionists/Israel, C=Palestinians/Arabs. I really can’t simplify it more than that my friend.

    I mentioned above my disdain/displeasure for the Arab regimes. Arab states are part of the problem, not the solution. They do not represent the Arab people because they do not care for their interests (only their own). Now while Israel is a democracy among Jews only (it is certainly not with the Palestinians), your governments are NOT looking after your people’s interests. It claims it does. But it doesnt. These are politicians and they lie to you and play on your emotional/psychological sides. Think about it for a second: if Israeli policies didnt take away the Palestinian people’s undeniable rights to their homeland, then why would Arabs want to fight back? What would we be fighting for? Do you genuinely think we are violent people that want to murder you just because you’re a Jew? NO. We Palestinians have been disenfranchized, our lands were stolen, our homes robbed, our lives spread to all corners of the earth. Because of that, we caused problems for other, the Lebanese especially during the civil war. Do you realize what a cancerous trend Israeli policies have implemented in the region? That trend created the situation on the ground now. Suicide bombers, fanatic movements, and corruption from the Palestinian side are symptoms; they are not the disease.

    If I were in your shoes, I would:
    1) Read The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine by Israeli historian Ilan Pappe, among coutnless of other Israeli authors and Jewish writers who see the clear picture (refer to Jews of Conscience link above).
    2) Come to terms with the fact that Zionism is racism and ruined the lives of millions (including fellow Jews)
    3) Join the Israeli activisist movement that is not believing what their gvt is saying. They have left the flock of sheep. They have freed their mind from being obsessed/brainwashed with fear and security. They want a one-state solution where the holy land can return to original status where Jews, Christians and Muslims lived side by side in peace and harmony.
    4) As an Israeli and a Palestinian, you and I must recognize that our “governments” are taking us for a ride and both our peoples are suffering because of them. Your “government” is the disease, while my “gvt” is the symptom. Work towards freeing the Palestinian people by returning all their rights back and you will free the Israeli people. It is a guarantee. No Hamas, No Jihad, No rockets. No nothing.

    Reply
    1. passing-by Avatar
      passing-by

      Now that was an amazing post. You should have your own blog.

      Reply
    2. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      Mohannad, very good post.

      “You’re asking me why will Hamas disapper. Because when you alleviate the Palestinian people and give them freedom, justice, and equality, then they wouldnt need to elect a party like Hamas”
      It is not me who needs to alleviate the Palestinian people and give them freedom. It is the Palestinian people who needs to want to be free. Will the secular Palestinian be free under a sharia regime? Then why did they elect the hamas in the first place? If it is to fight corruption, which is the common answer, then I tell you that there is something completely wrong with the democratic thinking of the Palestinian people. No democrat should ever elect a group of people that believe that democracy isnt good. So the Palestinian may win over Israel, but eventually they will lose their freedom to their own people. In Israel we fight corruption through the means of the legal system. we don’t elect an extereme group to lead us.

      “That root cause is your governtment’s policies”
      Our policies are just a reaction to the situation. Yes, we dont like hamas, yes, we don’t agree with its ideology and the fact that it has chosen to solve the conflict by force, eliminating in the process all the achivements that have been accomplished over the years. As a result we had to blockade Gaza, to prevent hamas from acquiring more and more weapons.

      “What Zionism did was literally replace one existence (my people’s existence) with yours. Is this fair?”
      First, we didn’t replace anything. Israelies and Palestinian still lives here together on the territory between the sea and the jordan river. your people exists. we don’t want you to cease to exist, and want you to stop wanting to destroy us. saying that I would say, again, that it is your leader, who decide that he wishs to continue the conflict, and we are very sorry for that.

      “Tel Aviv is your home. BUT…you cannot be there and live there at the expense of others. .. That does not mean you can kick a Palestinian because he’s Arab or not Jewish.”
      I am not living at the “expense of” anyone. We build this country to be what it is in 70 years and it was hard. Palestinian were offered the opportunity to do so twice. once in 1947 in the United Nations’ partition plan, and second time in the 90’s. In both cases the palestinian through their leaders chose war instead of trying to build their own state in the territory offered to them. The fact that people left their homes and didn’t return since, is a result of the combats during these years. Israel is ready and it had negotiated about the possible return of those who left. It should be part of the solution. It is our way of saying that during the 48 combat there have been things in our side that may have occured, and we regret them. Well your side was no angels back then too. In this I refer to the occurances mentioned by Ilan Pappe that you mentioned that may or may not have happened. I don’t see it as a reason for me to completely abandon my belief that your side was part of the blame for happened to them, since your side, too, was involved in many wrong doing.

      A->B->C slapping scenario:
      A (germany, and in more general note the whole world, because jews have been prosecuted in many places in the last 2000 years) slapped us. after the slap it sent us to live with C in the same house (1947 in the United Nations’ partition plan). for 70 years now B and C are slapping each other. The real question is can B and C live happily ever after in this house?

      “I mentioned above my disdain/displeasure for the Arab regimes. Arab states are part of the problem, not the solution.They do not represent the Arab people”
      The fact that you don’t admire governments and you feel that they don’t represent you is a problem. Governments are the force that control our life here on the planet. It is a problem for you, but it is also a problem for me, because to solve the dispute there has to be leaders that their judgement will be accepted by their people. If you say that your goverment doesn’t represent you it how can we agree on anything?

      “If I were in your shoes, I would:”
      “1) Read The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine” -> As I said, I believe that both side are to blame.

      “2) Zionism is racism and ruined the lives of millions” -> Disagree. Zionism is a national jewish movement for the desire of the jewish people to be free in there own country, after being prosecuted for 2000 years.We are prefectly able to live side by-side peacefully next to Palestinian, if they don’t desire to kill us. The Palestinians were offered twice to stop the killings and build their own country, in both cases they refused.

      “3) Join the Israeli activisist movement that is not believing what their gvt is saying.” – Especially today with the internet and all, I can safely say that I don’t need to do that. If my government is telling me lies believe me that I will find it in the internet.

      “4) As an Israeli and a Palestinian, you and I must recognize that our “governments” are taking us for a ride and both our peoples are suffering because of them.” -> I don’t envy bibi. I wouldn’t want to be in his place. to be a prime minister in israel in not an easy job. just imagine what he had to cope with when hew has to decide, for example, should he approve or not approve the boarding of the flotilla, knowing that he is an lose-lose situation. let it pass, and he is risking the possiblity that next ship will not be an aid ship but a war ship. board it, and he risk for lives being risked (Israelies soldiers, and the finest of them, because it is one of our elite groups that had performed the boarding), and international media disaster. And he has to make decisions like that on a daily basis. So no. I disagree with your sentence at least from my side. I understand why you don’t like Bibi as our leader, but I feel that he really tries his best to improve my life. sometimes he makes mistakes. well, we are all humans.

      Hezi

      Reply
  23. Mohannad El-Khairy Avatar
    Mohannad El-Khairy

    The main issues:
    1) Does Israel have a right to exist? (Yes\No)
    If you consider “Israel” the state that has stole my land, ethnically cleansed my people, jailed/rapes/occupies my nation? The NO. But Jews living in the Holy Land? Yes. They’ve lived there for the past 3,000 years. No one ever said no to that.

    2) Does Israel have a right to blockade Gaza? (Yes\No)
    Israel does NOT have the right to blockade Gaza. Legally, it was NEVER approved by the Security Council. Morally, you are committing GENOCIDE in the Gaza Strip. Do you realize that you are supporting a Holocaust in Gaza? How could Jews not see this?? This is astonishingly worrying that you make reference to the Holocaust for the reason for Israel to exist. But commit the exact same policies on others!

    3) Does Israel have a right to board a ship, in international waters, trying to break the blockade? (Yes\No)
    It does NOT have the right. You are completely unaware of the fact that the blodckade is illegal in the first place. So breaking it IS legal, and attacking a ship still in international waters trying to break it is ILLEGAL.

    4) What exactly happened on the Ship? (Massacre\Self Defense)
    Self Defense. Right. Self defense from unarmed humanitarian aid workers who your army shot at for hours before boarding the ship. Did you even see how the commandos were dressed? I can not believe what a coward army you have in Israel. All this army gear and machine guns and helmets and pistols and bombs vs civilians holding metal bars and scissors and knives that were on the ship for OTHER reasons (they’re on a ship for God’s sake!).

    Man Hezi, its best you stop. You’re way out of line. You’re exposing the Israeli mindset as a barbaric, freakish, pathologically murderous one. The more you talk like this, the more you will alleniate your people.

    I’m done.

    My answer to the above are Yes, Yes, Yes and Self defense.

    Israel has a right to exist, therefore it has the right to defend itself from attacks coming from Gaza, who fired rockets on our cities only 2 years ago and are still trying to accumulate weapons. There is no real blockade on Gaza because it has a border with Eygpt, a arab country that should be friendly with the Gaza people. The is no real starvation in Gaza, because Gaza economy gets most of it supplies through tunnels, so there was actually no real need for the aid ship. Life in Gaza is probably not be very convinent, but Plastinian people can only blame themselves. They elected hamas to be their leaders (actually they didn’t, hamas took control by force).
    Whether or not it was legitimate to board the ship is an issue for the international court. Israel certainly feels that it had right to do so, and we will defend our right (I hear now that Turkey wants to sue us. Well, we see have it goes.
    What happened on the ship was no massacare. It was an act of self defense from the soldiers that felt that their life where threatens. Again I will say that if a policeman ask you to stop for inspection and you decide to take his gun and try to kill him, don’t be suprised to see that he trys to defend himself.
    there is a declared naval blockade on Gaza, this was the situation (no matter if it is legitimate or not). Trying to break a blockade, even with an aid vessel, is an act of war. So who is the aggersor?

    Reply
    1. Hezi Avatar
      Hezi

      I will continue just so that Maya will have a few more fans to her blog..

      That’s until she or the majority of the people on this blog will say that they have heard enough or will have no more power discussing the issues. I think that it will be a pity, because not often, especially in these days, you are able to really talk with the other side and see that he is no different than you. This is a power given to us by the internet, and I for one, thinks that we should use it. What worries me is that if you lost hope on me, then there is probably no other solution then to solve the dispute with violent which will result even more people from both side that will be dead.

      Do you understand that when you say no to the first main issue than logically it is a must that you don’t agree on the rest of the issues? Of course that if you say that Israel has NO right to exist then you wouldn’t understand why we blockade Gaza, why we needed to stop the ship, and once we boarded the ship and encounter a bunch of people which, now that the picture is getting clearer I think that I can be safe to say, came to Maramra with the intention to kidnap soldier/s, and negotiate their way to Gaza over them. Well they succeeded and in the combat to free them 9 of your people died. Again I say that it was no massacre, it was a combat, and during combat people die.

      We, the jews, have been prosecuted for more than 2000 years now. It is not just the holocust. We have been exiled 3 times. First by the Assyrian, than by the Babylonians, than by the Romans. We have been massaced in Spain, England and Poland in the middle ages, and only then by the Germans during WWII. You must understand that we must have a home for the my people. This is way there has to be a jewish state. this is NOT because we are racist. I cannot sterss this enough. I am not a racist person, and nor are the majority of the Israelies. For me to be a racist means to completely hate beyond any resonable logic a certain race. This is what anti semetizm means. Can you tell me why did hitler wanted to kill ALL the jews? it was pure hate. pure evil. because of our history, now that we have a country, a jew that lives somewhere in the world must know that whenever he feels thretened he can always come to Israel. Just an example from this week events: Jews in Turkey are probably already thinking whether or not to leave it over the recent events, since the atmosphere in Turkey has changed dramatically against them.

      Now that we have a home, which was given to us in the 1947 UN partition plan, the last thing in the world that we want is to lose it. We really want peace, but whenever we hold our hand in peace you slap it. I don’t say that mistakes have not been made in the past. but we can continue to dwell in the past, or we can try to put the past behind us and move forward. From where I am standing it seems that it is your people that are more inclined toward solving the conflict by force. Why don’t you take an example from Eygpt, Jordan? The peace process stopped in 2000. had it continued, you could have your own country right now, with air and naval ports, fleets coming to Gaza on a daily basis, with no need for the Turk\Iranian escort.. But arafat chose the way of violence and this is where we are today. It seems that until the region will become like Bosnia with millions dying in both sides, there will be no stop, and I ask you, who will benefit from such a thing? I tell you who will lose. Us, the common people.

      Let me ask you this. Lets say that hamas\Turk\Iran destroys Israel. Do you really thinks that your people will be free? I oppose hamas not only because it hates me, but also because it puts barriers on people, your people, thoughts and free will. Will the PLO and hamas immidiately be friends when Israel will be gone? After our dispute is solved with violence, it is a slippary road to solving the rest of them with violence too. Take an example from our independance history: it took a civil war (check Altalena Affair in wikipedia). Are you sure that you will be on the correct side? Just a reminder, last time your side lost.. And since is funded by Iranian oil, and probably will continue to be so even after Israel will be gone, I believe that you will lose again.

      It was only since I started writing in here that I understood that the problem is really big. Look at the response that I get to my posts. It seems that no one on your side can even remotely think that there is a way to solve this problem other than using force.

      I hope that I am wrong

      Masaa al-khair (Good night?)

      Hezi

      Reply
      1. passing-by Avatar
        passing-by

        When an intruder hurts your family and occupies a large part of your home, you kick him out. You don’t just surrender and accept that your home has been invaded, your dignity lost. You fight until the last breath. It doesn’t matter if this happened yesterday or 62 years ago. That is how we are. If your reaction is to be submissive and accept the destruction and turn the other cheek, then act that way when some steals your home.
        You can nag about how you don’t feel secure in your “home”, or you can come to terms with the fact that it never was your home to begin with.

  24. Ruslan Trad Avatar
    Ruslan Trad

    Great post!:))

    Reply
  25. Rambo Avatar
    Rambo

    LOL… well Maya I guess you know how many visitors read your blog now.. haha. Ive never seen so many comments on here!

    Good post by the way!

    Reply
  26. Newby Avatar
    Newby

    Israel has requited several editors to distort wikipedia article about the incident. They work as a team and most are editing 24hrs.

    Reply
    1. HommusBetheeneh Avatar
      HommusBetheeneh

      ” …showing an Israeli soldier apparently being beaten with an iron pipe. Source: IDF”

      “Snapshot from IDF footage, showing an Israeli soldier being thrown onto a lower deck.
      Source: IDF”

      “…some of these items are visible in this picture[152], including knives, sticks, metal bars and other diverse tools, which were used as weapons[152] against the IDF by activists on board. Source: IDF”

      Correct, there are up to 235 sources in this article…

      Reply
  27. nayla Avatar
    nayla

    i loved it 🙂

    Reply
  28. Hezi Avatar
    Hezi

    I don’t have much time to write today. I apperciate your posts, I have some remarks about them, and I will try to comment on them as soon as I can. For the meanwhile I want to add one more thing. We here in Israel have a tendency to debate everything among us. As we speak there is an open discussion in our knesset (our parliament) about the flotilla. I want to translate to you what Ehud Barak, our ministry of defence, is saying there:

    “This is NOT the result that we wanted. we are dealing and will continue to deal with it in the future to continue providing security, the continuation of our efforts to stop the military empowerment of hamas in Gaza, the conditions to negotiate the terms of release of Gilaad Shalit and stopping raids from Gaza.. the operation of stopping the flotilla is causing a lot of citizens to feel pride in our soldiers, to feel angry on the flotilla orginizers, and FRUSTRUTIONS in the face of the failures.”

    I am trying to convey you my feeling that even ehud barak, our defence minister, is not thirsty for blood, and so we here believe that is it the same for our soldiers on the Marmara. However, they are soldiers, and they will shoot to kill if threatened, or if, in a broader view, will be sent to stop a flotilla that is threatening Israel, because hamas next step after the blockade will be lifted, will be getting even more arms, which will make this region even more dangerous to live in (for both sides). Israel is frustruted, because we know that we lost this battle, we fell into this media ambush, and as a result hamas is even stronger, and the blockade is dangered. on a more optimistic note I would say, that as a result, maybe the situation for the people in Gaza will be better now, because probably there will be some changes in the blockade strategy. Whether or not they will use them for good doings or bad doings only the future will tell.

    Hezi

    Reply
  29. almondjoycie Avatar
    almondjoycie

    very nice post. i shared it on my facebook.

    i just wanted you to know that YOU”VE been tagged in a writing exercise that you should LOVE!

    http://joycefied.wordpress.com/2010/06/06/i-love/

    Reply
  30. Wilmer Beshore Avatar
    Wilmer Beshore

    Great post, it opend my eyes, thanks!

    Reply
  31. Tabboule Avatar
    Tabboule

    Hezi, you say :
    “You must understand that we must have a home for the my people”
    Let’s assume you get alllllll of Palestine land, would that fit all your people?
    Do you know that there are millions of Lebanese in many countries? Don’t you think that all the people in the world who were ever chased out of their countries want to return?
    Don’t you think that a person, a people and a civilization should, if forced to be spread in many countries, grow in that new country?
    What would change if Jews chose USA as their land?
    You might say that Palestine has the wall of lamentations and is sacred for you. Well I am Christian and in Palestine we have many Christian sanctuaries… should all Christians in the world fight to get that piece of land?
    A civilization and a people is its culture and its mentality and its traditions…it is not its geographical location. Would an American Jew be more Jewish if he moves to Palestine?
    Regardless of the promises made to your people years ago, the Middle East conflict has been on for too long and damage has been made to all sides. Many innocent people have diet and extremist movements have only increased and gained power. Don’t you think it should end?

    You did not like when your people was chased out of Europe, but you are doing the same to the Palestinian people. You are chasing them from their homes, harassing them and killing them. You are treating them like cattle with all your check points and security measures. And that my friend is not humane. I wonder how you would like to be in their shoes for a few days.

    Then you say: “We really want peace, but whenever we hold our hand in peace you slap it”
    Killing 9 people on an aid ship and blocking thousands in Gaza is not exactly “holding your hand in peace”
    I would like to ask one question, I hope you can give me an answer to that:
    When Jews were in Nazi concentration camps, if a train full of food, clothes and medicine was coming their way but the Nazi blocked it, killed people on it and aid never arrived…. Would the Nazi behavior be ok in your opinion?
    Well my friend, Gaza is that concentration camp, and in this case you are the Nazi.
    Again you say: “Because hamas next step after the blockade will be lifted, will be getting even more arms, which will make this region even more dangerous to live in (for both sides)”
    Here I ask how do you see that it is ok for Israeli to have weapons and military power but you want no one else to have it?

    Hezi, I think that if we knew you in person, me and most people commenting on this blog would join up for a drink and have a pleasant conversation. Because we would realize that we all see things the same way. (more or less)
    The truth is, that is that this conflict is within the hands of the people in charge. And unless we stop following like cattle, both your people, the Palestinians and the Lebanese will continue to die and suffer.

    So quoting the Robin hood movie: Rise and Rise again until the lambs become lions
    There will be no solution to this mess, unless the people stop following the bloody and inhumane orders of our greedy leaders

    Reply
  32. mc Avatar
    mc

    ya Hezi ….

    what you said is exatly what I think about you:
    “It seems that no one on your side can even remotely think that there is a way to solve this problem other than using force. ”

    Abbas is not using force and you continue colonisation, how do you expect me to explain to hamas that they should negociate rather than use the rockets….

    masa el kheir (good evening)

    Reply
  33. Moobz Avatar
    Moobz

    One thing I learned in forums, talking to the people who defend Israel and its politics: you cannot establish the fact of who’s the victim. Never.
    Since both parties think they’re victims… there’s no point in arguing.

    IDF kills 9 people. IDF victims. Insulting.

    “They got the guns, but we got the numbers.
    Gonna win yeah, we’re taking over.
    Come on!”

    Oh and… the robin hood movie was too lame ! :p

    Reply
  34. Activismo feminista a través del cómic – periodismohumano

    […] social y las féminas encuentran en el mismo una herramienta de expresión poderosa, como demuestra otra de nuestras heroínas, Maya, el vivo retrato de su creadora, Maya Zankoul y tan sorprendida como ésta por la realidad […]

    Reply
  35. Hezi Avatar
    Hezi

    So many comments and I am only one, so I will try to answer all of you at once.

    “Since both parties think they’re victims… there’s no point in arguing” (Moobz)
    I think that he his correct about each side feeling victims, but I think that discussing the problems is the only way. Not talking about the problem will create a vaccum that will lead to future wars.

    So far the only solution that I hear from most of you is that jews should go back to whrere ever they came from. something along the line of:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQcQdWBqt14
    You probably will be suprised to know that I don’t think it is acceptable. In fact most of the western leaders don’t. Obama for example: http://www.viciousbabushka.com/2010/06/president-obama-helen-thomas-was-out-of-line.html
    This is to show you that the world doesn’t like your idea. At least for now, they think that they gave us the right to be here in the UN partion plan back in 1947.
    In addition, if you disagree with the world and you still want to kick us out, the jews in Israel should be kicked to somewhere in the world. I already said in a post to Ash, that maybe some of the jews will find a way to get us of Israel. but most of us here have no where to go. Literaly. we cant flee to other country, because we are not citizens there. I cant just move to US if I want too. Who said that the US is ready to accept 6 million new citizens? And why the US? there is a big population in Israel that came from arab countries. Do you think that they will be accepted there?
    Even if 75% of the jewish population will be kicked out from Israel, you will still have to deal with 1.5 millions jewish Israelies. What will you do, put us in a concentration camp in Gaza? What will you do when jewish aid flotilla will come, when suicide bombs and missiles will hit your cities?
    One final note on this solution. I suspect that you are talking about only kicking out the jews from Israel, not the Israeli-arab that live here, some of them probably served in our army and fought with us against your people. If it is only the jewish (race) that you want to kick out from here, isn’t that making you as racist as the racist that you claim me to be?

    I heard that there is an increasing support among Palestinians in the solution in the other end of the political spectrum. I mean “one state, 2 nations”. I don’t think that this solution is possible (at the moment). I will explain:
    I argue that the differences between the Israeli and the Palestinian people are (at the moment) too big, so they cannot be contained under one state.
    I argue that we will not be able to decide on even the most simple matters for example what will be our flag, our official language, our national holidays, our national antheme.
    How can we build a country together with so many different opinions, with hate and fear that was constructed in a 100 years of conflict?
    I believe that such a state will not be able to function, and as a result tension will increase, probably leading to civil war (same as in Yugoslavia).
    Where in recent world history such a merge between two different peoples succeed? How about the afro-americans in the US. only 50 years ago they were segregated. See how well they blended in the american society: afro-american president, movie stars, basketball players and so on in every aspect of the everyday life. What is the difference between the afro-americans and our situation? I argue that it is the fact that they “blend”. They fitted themselves into the american culture. They didn’t introduce a new flag, they don’t have their own language and overall they feel comfortable within the american way of life. In order for such a success to happen in our region one culture will have to blend into the other. I argue that this is not the path that things are leading to at the moment. it actually seems that there are 3 nationals within this Jordan river and sea, with the jews, PLO and hamas. If you cant agree among yourself (hamas and PLO) how do you expect to agree with us?

    I said that “one state, 2 nations” is not acceptable for NOW. This is because I think that the best analogy to our state right now is of 2 high noon gunmen shootout, their pistols drawn out, shouting at each other to lower their weapons. For them to hug at the end of the movie it would take a PROCESS, where the first step is to lower the guns.

    What is my solution? I think that the first step should be to stop the war between our people and sit to talk, continue from the point that it was stopped:
    http://www.mideastweb.org/campdavid2.htm
    I am, and most Israelies are great supporters of a solution in the lines that was suggested there. The exact border, the exact solution for the refugee issue should be discussed. I am probably won’t be able to discuss this because I am not able to get down to the little details that it requires. However, I like the idea that it holds a compromise, where each side has to give up some of its ambitions. No losers, just winners, because each side will have a state where it can live peacefully. remember that the only ones that loses from the current state is the common people.

    Only such a sulotion might lower the walls of fear and hate between our people, which might eventually bring down the physical barrier that we build between us. I think that this is the only solution at the moment, and I really think that abu-mazen wants to go there. however we in Israel don’t feel that he has the support from your people. This is because you are not actively supporting him. This is because you actively support hamas, no matter what it does.do you think that it was smart from hamas to fire rockets on Israel 2 years ago? You honestly want me to believe that there is no critics for hamas in the whole Palestinian population? I argue that they just fear to speak, beacuse they know what happens to those who oppose the regime that support the Iranian ideology:
    http://www.youtube.com/verify_age?next_url=http%3A//www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DYi21hNoEkaE
    Maybe when your twitter and google will start to be censored, and sharia will be forced on you, only then you will be awaken and understand.

    Hezi

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  36. Global Voices em Português » Líbano: Blogosfera movimentada após ataque israelense à flotilha de Gaza

    […] observado na caricatura do popular blogueiro Maya Zankoul, acima, os libaneses em grande parte estão não apenas indignados pelas ações de Israel, mas […]

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  37. Scot Ilse Avatar
    Scot Ilse

    I probably would not have contemplated this was useful two or three years back, yet it is interesting how age evolves the manner you respond to things, thanks for the article it really is pleasing to see anything smart here and there rather than the regular rubbish disguised as blogs and forums at the web. Regards

    Reply
  38. Anonymous

    […] féminas encuentran en el mismo una herramienta de expresión poderosa, como demuestra otra de nuestras heroínas, Maya, el vivo retrato de su creadora, Maya Zankoul y tan sorprendida como ésta por la realidad […]

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